Legendary Disney directors Ron Clements and John Musker on Moana, Hercules, Disney and Dwayne Johnson.
Ron Clements and John Musker are movie stars to me.
Even in the movies of theirs I warm to less, theres something I latch on to.
Its calledMoana, and I got to pretend to be professional, and chat to them about it.
I just about held it together for the full interview too.
Youre proud of me, right?
What a human filmMoanais.
Can you talk us through what your way into the story was?
John M:Reading the mythology, and learning about it.
Id never been to that part of the Pacific.
But it seemed very picturesque.
The sculptures there seemed very primal and powerful.
So that led me to read mythology.
A shape-shifter, a trickster, he had a magical hook like Thors hammer.
He has tattoos that told the story.
All of that seems bigger than life, and such ripe for animation.
That was five years ago.
John was intrigued by it, and the character of Maui.
But then he said youve got to dig deeper into the research.
And he forced us to go to the Pacific Islands!
Where we had to endure time in Tahiti and Fiji and Somoa [laughs].
It was really wonderful, and transformative, all the lessons we learned when we got there.
We took a deeper dive into the culture.
RC:We really met some incredible people on that trip.
Linguists, anthropologists, fishermen, navigators, chiefs, villagers.
We learned about the history of navigation, and how important it was.
These were the greatest navigators the world has ever known.
And a connection to their ancestors.
The story of this teenage girl, and her quest.
You said that you saw Disney princesses not as that, but as a band of superheroes.
Do you have similar feelings with Moana, and the character you wanted to bring to the screen?
JM:We did think of Moana as a different kind of princess.
We jokingly characterised her as a badass princess!
It was really a heros journey, where the fate of the world was in her hands.
It was never really gender-dependent.
There was no romance either.
When we built Moana physically, we also wanted to push her in a different direction.
She needed to dive off cliffs, fight pirates, steer a boat on the open sea.
She was fun to work with, was willing to improvise.
She was really inspiring.
Her tenacity and her empathy was reflected in Moana.
Theyre buddies, and that helps.
I did want to talk to you about casting.
I got really deep into how the two of you approached thecasting ofHercules.
How early in your thinking, then, does someone like Dwayne Johnson come into a film like this?
And how does the casting in turn affect how you mould the story?
JM:We thought of the character of Maui before we thought of Dwayne Johnson.
But Dwayne entered the picture very early on.
And she herself was half-Samoan.
We knew of Dwaynes roots, and that hes connected to the islands.
Also, Maui is a demi-god, and Dwayne certainly seemed like a demi-god!
We brought him in.
We never auditioned anyone else for the part.
And then Jared Bush, the final writer on the movie, certainly got aspects of Dwayne.
In earlier versions, Maui seemed more negatively, curmudgeonly, unlikeable, whatever it might have been.
Theres a charismatic part of Dwayne where he can say almost anything and get away with it.
Lin thought a song like that might be difficult to pull off for someone other than Dwayne.
His instant likeability, his man of the people persona, he redeems all that and makes it ingratiating.
RC:Also, Dwayne was really excited about singing a song!
He was very eager, and Lin wrote that song specifically.
A theme song for Dwayne.
Its got enough knowingness to it hasnt it, where he can get away with it?
Dwayne has a slyness to him.
Thats a much better way of putting it.
Thats why you two are billionaires, and Im not.
[They both laugh, but neither denies it.
That you brought someone in onMoanawho couldnt quite wrap their head around it?
Because casting must be incredibly difficult.
This movie is unique I think.
It doesnt have as many voice actors than a lot of our movies.
A lot of the characters dont speak in this one.
But most of the voice actors are all from the region.
Everyone was pretty much on-board.
One of the things I really loved is that you got Eric Goldberg in to do 2D animation onMoana.
We love Eric Goldberg, weve worked with him since he did the Genie inAladdin.
Hes the master of particularly cartoony, entertaining and musical animation.
Putting something across in pantomime.
From the get go, we wanted to incorporate hand drawn animation, and Eric is the master.
He really loved working on the movie.
A lot of the CG animators are in their 20s and early 30s, and they watchedAladdinas kids.
And here they were, working side by side with the man who brought the Genie to life.
That was very special for them.
Do you get the animators in awe of you too, though?
RC:Its true.
Things come full circle.
That was very cool, I think.
JM:I was really amused.
I saw some Tweets.
There was one of the animators who we gave some scenes to.
He was very soft spoken and very close.
He was very understated.
But there was more than one person who was like that.
We liked that, it was fun.
We got to help pass the torch to men and women who grew up on our films.
I wont save it for a Tweet.
JM:Thats cool.
I think thats true, and I hadnt thought about that.
When you look at the complexities of CG images, theyre so rich on the screen.
But if you want to draw the characters from the movie, I do think its tougher to do.
Hand drawn characters give you an entry into that.
RC:I hadnt thought about that.
When I was a kid, I watchedPinocchio, I would go home and draw.
It was the thing you did.
And itisa little trickier.
I showed them Cartoon SaloonsSong Of The Sea, for instance.
Have you seen that?
The graphic shapes are very strong, and Id think kids can latch onto those.
RC:Thats a good question.
That was a choice.
We felt that the CG was appropriate for this story.
We feel for the right kind of story, different techniques are still viable.
Itll be a question I think for the future.
JM:We had a few years where we were exploring other things… Youve explored them now.
JM:Well get a move on!
RC:Well take your words to heart!
Ron and John, thank you very much!
Moana is in UK cinemas from December 2nd.
