This interview contains spoilers.
Two issues into his new Batman series, its quite obvious that Snyder wants to top himself.
Even Batmans closest allies seem to be turning on him.
Snyders new book is basically Batman vs. the World.
But hes not just a sidekick.
The idea is that every member of the Bat family falls under a different color on the wheel.
Dick is blue, Damien is green, and Barbara is purple.
you could also find the first part of ourAll-Star Batmaninterviewshere.
Den of Geek: I think youre doing a book unlike any other in the current Batman line.
Youre mixing really dark stuff with a lot of humor.
How do you balance both the dark and light sides of Batman?
The things Im terrified of and the things Im hopeful about.
My life is the page.
One of the things thats great is that hes a character that lends himself to very personal stories.
Is the sum of my personal demons greater than the things that I like about myself?
Its a story that keeps things grounded in terms of what its about.
It allows me to go farther and farther off the reservation.
Declan Shalvey:For me, Im a fan of really dark, depressing stuff.
Even for a reader, theres only so much punishment they can take.
Youve got to give them a break here and there.
I had to fight for wingdings.
He needs to curse sometimes!
It works so well!
So Declan, youre drawing the much darker part of the book.
Whats it been like drawing Batman for you?
DS:I feel like Ive been training my entire career for this moment in a lot of ways.
It has been intimidating, scary, exciting, and incredibly satisfying.
Theres a page in #2 where I did one of the most interesting pages Ive ever drawn.
I had to think, This is a big, blockbuster comic book.
Youre prepared to be more fan service-y or bombastic.
SS:Thats one of my favorite pages that Iver ever seen in a comic that Ive worked on.
You guys must be talking about the awesome Duke portrait on the first page of The Cursed Wheel.
Can you talk a bit about the process of making that page?
DS:Well, Scott was just like, I have this idea.
What do you think?
You cant just change things afterwards.
You have to get it right on the page.
So all I saw was the potential to make a hundred mistakes and ruin the piece.
And when I have to take a risk and jump in.
It was an interesting idea.
I couldnt recall ever seeing it in a comic.
The fact that I didnt know how I was going to do it was a huge challenge.
I think it might be one of my favorite pages Ive ever drawn.
If you ever see the black and white, thats what I did.
Scotts idea was a montage, but a lot of that is actually about color.
How did you guys come up with the idea for The Cursed Wheel?
So The Cursed Wheel, which Declan and Jordie are starting here, is the one constant.
Its a story in the backups that will go through the whole year and be the one consistent narrative.
It anchors the entire [book].
The features are all about villainy and who is Batmans greatest villain.
What are his greatest flaws?
How are the villains scary?
But the backup is all about heroism.
How am I my own greatest hero?
I felt it really balanced itself.
First of all, Declan in black and white is one of the best in the business.
Every character leans a little bit differently when it comes to Batmans own map of the color wheel.
Its been a blast.
DS:If youre talking about color and story, you want Jordie Bellaire.
She puts so much color within the work that she does.
Especially when I was reading the script, I was like, This is going to be Jordies jam!
Because its all about theme, color iconography, and color as character.
And I was like, Oh, she used yellow!
And then I was like, Of course, because yellow is Duke.
Shes always thinking about that stuff.
SS:She knows how to tell a story with color.
You get to play with shadow, mood, and tone.
And this is such a moody story.
Youve seen the first issue and what happened in the last page.
Some pretty awful stuff.
I dont know why I seem to be very good at drawing it!
Scott, since you created Duke in Zero Year, youve been slowly developing the character in your stories.
What makes him such a captivating character for you?
Shell show up and help Batman, but she never wants to know if hes Bruce Wayne.
Duke is a character who believes that heroism and the Robin mantle can exist entirely separate from Batman himself.
Now who he is as a hero is sort of up for grabs.
Its a conversation about where does he fit?
Is there a role that he can play in Gotham as a hero that hasnt been done before?
I spoke to Geoff Johns a lot.
And hope that they have legs.
Thats the biggest fear you always have creating new people.
You love them, but then they kind of dissipate.
Something I really like you guys are doing is showing the ups and downs of Bruce and Dukes relationship.
Even when Gordon and Alfred have turned on Batman in the story, Duke rushes out to help him.
What makes Bruce and Dukes bond ultimately so strong?
SS:He sees a lot of himself in [Batman], you know?
Theyre not just gone or irretrievably lost.
And Im NOT curing them, so you could put that out there!
Theres no relief from that.
I think thats a horrifying thing.
You dont give up.
And thats what Gotham is about.
Dukes been about that from the beginning.
What doubly impresses Bruce is that hes about doing it himself, which is how Bruce was, too.
Its not about being part of a Bat family or being under Batmans wing.
Its about inspiring other people.
And theres nothing comparative to Damien [the current Robin] or any of the other characters.
I love those characters.
And this isnt, This is better than that.
I think a couple of people misread what we had said in the first issue about that stuff.
Declan, you mentioned theme, whether it be evil or motivation.
Do you find yourself tackling each theme differently in terms of the art?
DS:Not necessarily.
It always depends on whats in the script.
Im drawing something in #3 at the moment thats absolutely very different.
You always want to venture to be doing something different.
you could be very weighed down by previous takes on the character and what x and y should be.
You dont want to be rehashing things youve seen before.
Its something Ive quite liked about what Scotts done on the Batman books previously.
The approach is very different.
No matter what, its always whats in the scripts and what the point of the story is.
As somebody whos invested in story, character is so much of what pulls me in.
Something I venture to do with every page is whats the focus?
Whats the focus of the emotion?
And I work with that.
What can you tell me about the next issue?
SS:In the feature, its out of control.
Its where everything ramps up insanely.
There are a lot of big surprises.
In the backup, its the penultimate issue.
Batman and Duke deal with Zsasz and what he means.
To be able to say, This is a horrible moment.
Im at my lowest.
I dont know if I can do this.
Although I know you know what hes going to do!
It goes on all year, so hes not going home.
It would just be empty backups looking at a chair for the whole thing.
But itll be dramatic, I promise!
That was pretty sweet!
Thanks so much, Scott and Declan!All-Star Batman#2 is out now!
John Saavedra is an associate editor at Den of Geek.
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